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Anchoring systems trials and tribulations.
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mgav451
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September 15, 2019 - 9:30 pm
Member Since: September 27, 2017
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So I finally got the bowsprit 100% finished. It's really nice. I have no cleats up there as of now.  Anchoring with this sprit is a new animal to me. My Samson posts don't have a fairlead to the bow due to my windlass ( plus the anchor chain will be occupying the roller at that time) so tying a snubber off to them and anchoring straight off the bow isn't a good option. 

So the port and starbd holes in the gunnels ( not sure what these are called) is the next option.  I assume a bridle/snubber long enough to clear the end of the sprit is the next logical option. This torments me with ideas of chafe. Granted I'll be using chafe gear and the bridle will be long enough to clear the sprit. It's still inevitable this will often chafe , rub, and foul. And with wind shifts, the boat turning ,sailing at anchor, tide shifts, and Murphy's law seems like it's gonna be a hard nights rest. With that bridle always being an issue.

  So I have an extra hole in my upper bobstay Tang for a snatch block Or shackle for the snubber. This is less then ideal having the anchor point all the way fwd like that. Lots of stress on the rig etc. Lots of motion.

I think my next job is going to cut the existing lower bobstay fitting as close as I can and glass the hole in .  From what it looks like in my preliminary plans is that the existing bobstay has tabs on the inside of the hull that are glassed in. I'm gonna make a massive lower bobstay fitting to go over the old one on the outside I'll through bolt this possibly through the one that's already glassed in and backing plate inside . This lower bobstay fitting  will have 2 holes . One for the bobsty and one under that for a snubber attatchment.  I'll run the snubber up the bobstay when not in use and attatch that when I deploy the anchor making for a lower angle better motion, and give me more scope.  However this option if fails could be catastrophic. And I'm not sure how I'd get 1/2" bolts through the encased bobstay fitting with out melting or screwing up the hull. But ideally it would be  ( off the top of my head the one that's there is shy of 5/8,  but that's what they should have made it 5/8. )  I'll make it the  next toggle size up from 5/8 thick with (4) 1/2" through Bolts. 

In my opinion any anchoring system ought to be a hurricane anchoring capeable attatchment point. My anchor size for my boat is ratedp as a  hurricane anchor and anchoring in a hurricane may be on the menu.... Carribean in the summer... 

 

So I guess all these options are feasable but each has its drawbacks with fouling the sprit,chafe,fairlead, pita to deploy, and the lower bobstay snubber being the best option in my eyes but alot of work I'm willing to do if it's the safest strongest result..

 

Any one have any pics or testimony of what works and what doesn't? What are you all Using? 

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jimha
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September 17, 2019 - 3:18 pm
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The chain plate for the bob stay on my DE38 was a problem for me.  There was rust seeping out the hull next to the chain plate.  I resolved the problem by attaching two chain plates on either side of the existing one, and then made a pin long enough to go thru all three pieces of stainless steal.  Glassed in the nuts on the inside of the hull to eliminate leaks. 

I have an all chain rode for my anchor.  I run a snubbing line that is 3/4 inch three strand nylon which I attach to the chain with a chain hook.  The snubbing line is about 30 ft long so that I can use it as a giant snubber when it is rough.  Letting out this much line and loose chain at the same time, causes the weight of the chain to act as a sentinel.  Both the chain and snubbing rope are led thru the same roller on the bowsprit.  I have put PVC pipe over the bob stay and turnbuckle to prevent chafe.  This PVC is between the dolphin striker and bowsprit.                        1-DSCF1251.JPGImage Enlarger

.

Hope this helps.  Cheers,

Jim

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mgav451
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September 18, 2019 - 9:42 pm
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Yes thanks . I was contemplating a dolphin stryker to,  seems the bobstay angle is a littke low and that solid clipper bow is almost made for it.  I'm always scared the anchor still foul it push it over and my bobstay will go slak. You see I have that dark cloud following me everywhere! 

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Leo Uhran
Port St Lucie Fla
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September 23, 2019 - 8:51 am
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My boat has a U-bolt mounted to the lower bobstay bracket. The Snubber attaches to this then to the anchor chain. The downside is you have to install the snubber after you are at anchor with a dingy. This arrangement can also be used to when set on a mooring taking the load off the bow sprit.

My bow sprit is brand new. I've yet to test this myself.

 

My boat                                                      

Mine.png

Example off the internet

Example.jpgImage Enlarger

 

Leo

SV Paper Moon

'77 Downeast 38

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mgav451
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September 24, 2019 - 8:38 pm
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That's what I was thinking .Leo do you have a dolphin stryker aswell?  Care to elaborate on it? 

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Leo Uhran
Port St Lucie Fla
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September 26, 2019 - 10:45 am
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Yes. But I don't know anything about it other than its purpose to add tension and improve rigidity of the bobstay/ bow sprit. Plus it looks good.

You have me wondering about this now too. I have dual anchors. Starboard is a Delta and the drop is located behind the top of the bobstay wire and may have the same potential of chafing that you seem to be worried about. However the starboard Bruce anchor drop  is in front of the bobstay and should not be any issue at all. Of course I don't consider this the primary anchor.

I wonder if I have the anchors backwards? I think the Delta is the better holding anchor for different bottoms. Does anyone have any comments on this? Or ever have issues at anchor with the chain rubbing when you swing at anchor. I'm really not sure this is even an issue. Regardless once the chain/anchor is out and set the tension keeps it in a straight line out from the bow. The two (chain and bobstay wire) should not ever really touch unless the chain is slack and just hanging straight down from the sprit.

 

Dolphin-Striker.jpgImage Enlarger

Dolphin Striker

 

Leo

SV Paper Moon

Port St Lucie Fla

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jimha
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September 29, 2019 - 6:31 am
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@mgav451

Your the lucky one , as my dark cloud usually come`s in 3's.  I think your over concerned about side pressure on the bob stay.  If you lead the snubbing line over the roller on the bowsprit, it is far enough forward to have minimal side pressure on the bob stay.  Also don't forget the whisker stays for helping with side pressure.  Your bob stay is the thickest wire in your standing rigging to support all the forces in you fore-stay when under sail. 

When you think of all this , your luckiest day was when you purchased a DE38.  A true , honest, cruising boat.  Not to say there are no problems... They definitely have a few.  I can't think of a boat that isn't a compromise of some sort.

Cheers and beers,

Jim

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mgav451
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September 30, 2019 - 10:29 am
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Finally had her out yesterday  .spreaders done and she is a fine balanced boat sails on rails. I think the addition of the strong back makes the spreaders nice and strong. 

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Scott Carle
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October 17, 2019 - 6:06 am
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Don't they sail nice. Ours always surprises me in that she always sails better than you think a big full keel boat like her would. 🙂 constantly makes me happy with her.

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Scott Carle DE38 Cutter s/v Valkyr
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Argyle38
US Northeast
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October 22, 2019 - 10:45 pm
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The DE38's and 45's come with a dolphin striker, the 32's don't. Not sure why since the 32 and 38 are almost the same once you get forward of the cockpit. Maybe the 32's sprit is a little shorter so they decided that the striker wasn't necessary. Who knows.

When I installed my windlass on the top of the bowsprit, I could no longer use the Sampson posts as bollards, the aft end of the windlass sits right in between the two posts so no line can fit. I installed two big bronze Herischoff cleats just forward of the forward hawse-holes. I made a bridle from two pieces of 3/4 3-strand, spliced together with a Manson boat hook spliced at the end. Each leg is around 10-12' long, long enough to extend well past the bobstay.

When the wind is up, neither leg touches the bobstay so no issues when it is under tension. In a calm or light breeze, and especially in shifting currents, sometimes the bridle will rub past the bobstay and sometimes rub past the dolphin striker with a 'boing' kind of sound. It can get annoying when sleeping, but you get used to it.

In heavy weather or with a lot of swell in an anchorage, my intent is to attache each leg of the bridle to dock line made fast at the stern of the boat, that way I'd have more rope length to absorb shock loads. I've not yet been in an anchorage with significant swell so that part is just theory.

There is some very light chafe starting to show on the bridle where they rub against the bobstay. I'll eventually get around to sewing on some leathers at that location. It's on the list...

 

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S/V Argyle Downeaster 38 #40 Long Island Sound
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bobmcd625
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April 6, 2020 - 7:45 pm
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I have been slow to post photos of my windlass installation but now, since I am "sheltering in place" and the rain is pissing down, I thought I'd do it.  Its a Lewmar Model H2 (no capstan) I got on eBay.  This model is supposed to be bolted to the deck from below but I wanted to mount it on the bowsprit so I had to have a bracket made which one can see in the pics.  I did not have to move the inner fore-stay and, while the rear end of the unit is between the sampson posts, I can still get a line around them for mooring.  I have since added a horn cleat forward of the unit. I did have to move the haws pipe and cover its old opening, but that was no problem.  The rode drops down nicely just into the deepest part of the anchor locker.  I'll post separately about the anchor locations.  Enjoy and keep well!

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bobmcd625
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April 6, 2020 - 8:03 pm
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Now for the anchor location on the bowsprit.

Originally, I guess as all DE38s were built, the anchor rode came through the bowsprit.  That is a fine idea, but, as others mention, that leads to chaffing on the bob stay as well as having the anchor foul the bobstay on the way down and up.  So...I moved the anchor to the end of the bowsprit as seen in this photo.  I think it is better but have not, honestly, used it enough to be certain.  I need to get a bigger and better bow roller than the one that is there now.  Maybe when it stops raining...

Best to all.IMG_20190816_133534.jpgImage Enlarger

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Scott Carle
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June 27, 2020 - 11:56 am
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Ours has starboard side anchor like stock but the port side is at the end of the bowsprit.

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Scott Carle DE38 Cutter s/v Valkyr
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mgav451
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July 31, 1924 - 7:02 am
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I picked up a mantus bridle works out pretty good. Just so happens the change guards are in the exact spot they need to be. 

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